March 6, 2023

The Bar Brawl Border War

Witness the clash of two superpowers, Maine and New Brunswick.

With a poorly defined border, living between both meant getting arrested for putting up flags or whistling the wrong songs. Some even got taxed twice. This lead to a mass troop build up and a classic bar room brawl.


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0:48 Hello, and welcome to Canadian politics is boring. My name is Rhys waters and with me is the impenetrable Jesse Holly. That's that's the seventh time you've said that. Which means it's just funny. I don't know what it means. You must keep trying to penetrate me which I I don't. But I know we've heard others have tried. We're on camera and I'm not at all self conscious right now. I'm getting a haircut later to fix this. Yes, nobody cares. Nobody cares. Yeah. Why are we doing it? Because it's for social media clips. Not for you to be vain. It's fine. Okay, so I want to I want to jump. I want to jump to the STDs zone. The small talk dimension short term, because I have a story for you are probably much more entertaining than my story which was about my power going out in my house and we having to help the electrician figure out what panel was for what today. It was super fun. Wow. Yeah, one panel was for like the bathroom and by the one bedroom and a singular power outlet. And then another panel was just for the bathroom lights. And another panel was just for yet another singular power outlet downstairs in the kitchen. It's a weird old house you'll find it's really safe. Its point of view going to catch fire any day now. Kill Us All in our sleep historic properties of Halifax a wonderful, I once no word of a lie in the same place. I was deciding to clean what what uh, you know, I wouldn't bother, right. Yeah, seriously. So I took a spray bottle and it was just spraying the walls and I sprayed the what's it called the light switch. Yeah, the light switch panel, right just like you know, green bottle of cleaner right? Not like fucking bleach or nothing. Because it doesn't really matter. And I just gave a little spray. 2:32 shut down everything. All the power went out. I'm like, What the fuck. And so we had to call in. I think they got in three electricians because the first electrician couldn't figure it out. And then the second electrician also couldn't figure it out. And so they had to bring in three electricians and they were in the attic. And they were like, digging through wires and like what the fuck is that? What is this house? And it took them like something like six hours before they could figure out how like Okay, so this wire goes through the kitchen into the bathroom that turns on the light in the attic. Okay, fine label and it's just it was 3:05 new to Brady. No, throw a party. 3:10 That's my STD zone terribly excited. Well, mine is. Oh, by the way, by the way, I just wanted to compliment you on an edit. Yes, that you did. Right. I laughed right out loud. What I did. There was for the premium episode. Have 3:25 fun with tunnels. Yeah, he's just put up. And in the freemium sort of model that we put up on the public for saying like, hey, come and check it out. Here's the teaser teaser. Yeah, thank you. That's much that's a better way of putting it. 3:40 You put in the story of me as the rickshaw driver right. And I was like a cliffhanger. What it was so good was caught me by surprise was like, oh, yeah, bring them up to the top of the hill. And then I step outside of the wings, and I bend down to pretend to tie my shoe. But really, I'm just out of breath. And then I look back and I see the rickshaw slowly starting to go backwards down the hill. And then you cut it off. I'm like, Oh, I'm so proud of 4:03 sales. It's called sales. We're not gonna get to sleep. I read a TV show for 10 years it's kind of what you do to keep the audience tuned in for that episode. Will they die 4:14 I feel like my mic is my mic really? If you don't know your mics good because I did the levels okay all right. I was screaming when you did my levels is fine. Because you asked me so good to be allowed boy you know you are allowed by you didn't ask you to be like asking you to exist 4:32 Alright, tell me your fascinating STD zone. I'm actually gonna want you to save it for premium episode because I don't want it to be. It's not a public story. I trust our patrons, but this is not a public story. They're going to do it in the next premium Are you serious as a sales tactic? Just sales tactic is just that. 4:48 That's kind of a I feel more comfortable when we only showed it with our special friends or special friends. Although we did have a message from someone saying that our show is half as fun for them now because they literally can only listen to her 5:00 Half of our show. It's not our problem. 5:03 They said they said they literally like fill the gap the gas tank up like $5 at a time and they'd love to subscribe but they just can't feel now I feel bad. I feel I do feel bad. So, to that to that listener, I'm very sorry. And but he did understand he was very young What really sucks is, is this is not the first time that we've had someone who has been financially challenged. Let's say is that a term? I'm going to coin it? Poor? 5:31 Right, right, everyone, everyone has a tough time or money from Satoshi unless they're most of my life but an artist when I see like a member of the Walton family or an Earth in or something but like we've had we've had emails where people calling like writing us and saying like Hey, I love your show. I seriously can't afford Patreon though but I just wanted to call it like right and give you our support and like I've been like oh my god, it feels so bad. I want to give them a free access to our patrons and the patrons won't let us it won't no no it's if you're coming to us with a good enough sob story I'd love to give I would love to as well yeah, if we're suckers for substance 6:04 but it's not it's just it's not our fault and I love that clause that we can blame we can blame that we really can because I tried I looked it up I was like a government employee blaming the system I'd love to help you. There's only two buttons in front of me. I seriously I looked it up like how to give away patriots. They won't let you know you can't do it it's not weird. Well it's not that's how they make their money I suppose. Yeah, yeah. Why would they give away free space because that means the costs and maybe else yeah, anyway John do another thing about some stuff. I want to learn to think about some stuff okay, good good. So this I've called this one the Bob rule border wall the Bob role border wall the Bob blah blah blah blah. The Pam ramp is also known as the Aerosoft Bob Bob Bob Bob Marrone. I still don't know he said a BA Brawl the border war. 6:54 Fuck your Welsh accent Okay, the bar Bob roll the bar roll bar the bar brawl bold a wall border war, the bar brawl border war. 7:07 The bar or bra or bar or bra? 7:11 You know, well, let's just call it what it is finally happened is the eristic wall or the pork and beans war or the Madawaska war. 7:18 I like the pork and beans. Now I think we should stick with the original title on Ba ba ba very catchy. 7:25 rolls off the tongue like a like an aquatic mine. Like a giraffe with marbles in its mouth. Exactly. 7:32 Well, that was your draft impression, do your draft. Do you remember that? 7:38 Do you remember that? 7:41 Because how can you forget the sound of a giraffe? Call it it's 7:48 those calling it's made this? I'm open and ready? We'll be presenting. 7:55 Let's make some more next. Anyway. 8:01 Remember, we've talked about the Canadian American border and the Treaty of Paris and how bad a job they did draw on the border, the Treaty of Paris. So in Paris, they drew the border between America and Canada using terrible maps. 8:15 And it's caused lots of problems since did we talk about this? We've talked about it in several episodes where we've talked about the Paris Treaty of Paris, it's the Treaty of Paris, in Paris, they did a treaty. Yeah. Where they decided where the border was between the US and Canada. Why in Paris because they like a neutral third party. 8:34 I honestly don't remember talking about this at all. It's good to see that this hopefully the audience's a, like probably 250 episodes of shit that I genuinely don't find interesting later. And I have retained a lot of information, sir. Honestly, I sometimes go that'd be a good idea for an episode and then realize we've already done it. 8:52 I don't believe so. So basically, they just settled the the Treaty of Paris that decided the border between the US and Canada. Maps weren't drawn properly. A lot of the time they were drawing borders. And no one had actually been there to draw an accurate map or they given they only had second hand information in inaccurate maps. Okay, so that's right. Oh, we did talk about that. Because I just forgot the whole Paris part because that's where we got that weird little jutting up part of states the secret entryways in Canada and America that we told everyone about, right? Yeah, that's, that's where that came. Right? Yeah. Find that episode, if you want to. 9:24 If you want to cross the border easily, yeah. Drugs was the backpack full of drugs. That's where to do it, folks. 9:30 So the St. John and Madawaska river basins are kind of the border there was blurry. So between St. John, New Brunswick and Maine in the 1830s, there was kind of a there was a bit of a border dispute because it was so blurry and no one really knew Am I in Canada? Am I in America Am I Am I can eat my pinky Canadian taxes and might be an American tax account what it's like right Can I own a gun main in St. John. I keep forgetting about St. John or St. John's my whole adult life. I still don't remember. The St. John isn't 10:00 It should essentially rebrand. Can you tell me? Is it st. St. John? St. John's is I got it right. I gotta write, I gotta write. I have heard stories of people getting on the wrong plane. So 10:12 it's a very easy mistake to make. So 10:15 that's July the fourth eating 27 Independence Day. 10:22 John Baker raised an American flag, which his wife made on the western bank of Baker Brook solo, an American flag his wife made like, I was like, I don't know, like, just just whatever wood laying around to use diapers and crayons and sort of thing. Yeah. Or, like bloodied rags for the red. That's gross. Yeah, that's okay. Sure. 10:44 And but it was on it was on the Canadian side of the St. John river. 10:51 And the New Brunswick authorities decided to arrest him. They find him 25 pound which would have been hard because he was probably using dollar they're arresting him for for putting an American flag up on the Canadian side of the river. You can do that. At this time. They couldn't they put him in jail where he was this this was 1827 they locked him in jail until he paid his 25 pound fine 11:12 25 pounds 25 pounds that's a lot and 18 11:16 especially if you use an American currency because he was an American. So 11:22 less than and then also what was happening as well, they were they even arrested someone for whistlin Yankee Doodle Dandy on the Canadiens you're fucking kidding. No, they did. 11:31 Wow, were we were dicks. I know. I know. And then also, they kept trying to get taxes off to businesses that were kind of in that blue area. So both governments would that you could get taxed by the Americans and the Canadians at certain points. go hey, you owe us tax and go I'm an American. No, you're not in Canada. We've got more guns than you so pay up and then the Americans can go hey, what's your tax? The Canadians just came in? Got it. What are you talking about? It would have been it was almost like a like a like a bad sitcom. 12:00 Okay, like Ludwigs jars. Exactly. Yeah. Which is a reference so many people won't get over Yeah, maybe 30 people. 12:11 So this was about to to kind of really want to make it an episode of Ludwig's journey to not actual video because that would be disgusting. That would be to watch a German aristocrat pooping her jaw. 12:24 on live TV, maybe. I mean, there's websites that do that kind of thing. But yeah, there's a small audience, which is a nice is a niche kind of audience. 12:33 We can make a small profit 12:36 market at this properly. And things were about to kind of ratchet up to the point where 12:42 people who were about to die from what was going on with this column what people were let's that's a that's a bit of a leap. So my flag up because we're charging you $25 and putting you in jail, which I'm assuming is just a tiny little room somewhere in a sheriff's house. Yeah. But you know, and then like, oh, you you know, you saying they could Doodle dandy we're gonna rescue to and this ramped up to people dying eventually. So but I think before we get to the, to the actual war, yeah, we should we need we're going to stop for a short commercial break. What kind of oh, this is this is what Greece wants to do and will comfortably let people understand because I was just dropping in this pin in the middle of sentences to say hey, is the ads now when it just dropped in? So I wanted to confirm to let you know that I mean, the theme music that comes in just before the ad is usually what lets people know there's an ad coming. But I thought we could just try this we could try saying hey, there's ads in 321 ad. 14:01 And we're back 14:07 for some reason, they decided not to run ads in this episode, that would have been funny, but if they did 14:13 so 14:15 mean despite may think, I think I want to amp that up next time. I want to try something a little bit more dramatic, okay, for letting people know there's an ad coming. Okay. So maybe we could do like, like, with sound effects and a little bit of music like little sounds like a lot of work? Well, I mean, you started 14:33 I just wanted to say there's an outcome and we didn't land on. I don't want to make some kind of audio drama. Like, I want to do 14:42 like a Mexican, sort of soap opera, where we could like translate ourselves into Spanish and put some like soap opera music and, and like have like a 20 minute sort of lead up to the fact that an ad is coming. Oh, we could just learn about 15:00 The fascinating stories of Canadian politics and history. 15:04 All we can do all we can do a bad 15:07 Mexican soap opera apparently 15:10 started out here, man. I thought it was. I thought we were brainstorming. 15:15 I was trying to get back to the to the death. So anyway, 15:19 Maine was pissed off. Alright. So they raised money to equip 10,000 militiamen. 15:27 Hello. And what, meanwhile, was being pissed off because they were arrested Americans. Oh, we haven't gotten to the killing yet. No, no, no. That was trying to give you a segue. So 10,000 militiamen were armed. And then they invaded the disputed territory. All right. They were known as the red shirts, and they marched straight past the Canadian Forces because they were totally outnumbered. And they're just like Rome, struggling each other. What, what the 10,000 armed Americans marched into your town and you're the federal government, there's like two of you. They're not gonna fight back. You're just gonna Oh, yeah, no, I guess we're Americans now. 16:06 Right. So they sent troops in response. And they were all positioned and all the newspapers were printing saying there's a war about to happen between Canada and America or between Maine and New Brunswick to be precise. The federal government wasn't getting involved on both sides. It was largely just between a state and a province. 16:28 And that's weird that they wouldn't get involved. Yeah, well, I think there were literally Canada was literally just invaded by 10,000 people. Oh, 16:39 that's a New Brunswick thing. Let them figure that out. Britain six like 16:46 but the American newspapers are basically saying things like, Maine could easily conquer Canada within six months, and then set up the domain may alone just mean, 16:57 and that they could really, cane is this this kind of military superpower 17:04 it's just a large forest with people at the bottom. 17:08 Right. Yeah, yeah, that's and that the governor of Maine would end up being the president of the New Republic, which sounds borderline treasonous. Right, and just go hey, means bigger. Good news. 17:20 New mean with 30% more land. Right, here you go. 17:26 But nothing ever happened. In the end, the kind of the federal government got involved. 17:34 And the the, there's this dude called General Winfield Scott, what a name I know. And to say it again, but like no more dramatic and slowly for me, let me see. It's your CC you're battling. I am General Winfield Scott. Then these are my dogs Gertrude and Samsung, Samsung. 17:59 French 18:04 no one can say it's French. Anyway. 18:07 So he basically showed a map that was drawn by Benjamin Franklin that showed that the disputed area was actually on the Canadian side and that they should kind of just basically firm up the map and get everyone to compromise and Maine Maine agreed to compromise which was good. However, before this happened, yeah. 18:30 There was things did boil over into violence, because the 18:38 while all the soldiers were camped out across this border, while there was no real border, they all ended up drinking in the same pub. American soldiers and and Canadian soldiers. Okay, so that's, that's a recipe for disaster will soon Oh, look, look who's over there with a drink. 18:55 So it led to a so what happened was they all 19:00 kind of got one or two ways honestly. 19:04 The best friends or everyone dies, someone drunkenly shouted success to mean, which is a really, like, such a success to mean No, I was talking generally. 19:16 And it resulted in a brawl where several broken noses and one broken arm happened. Oh, wow. Okay, so not nearly as bad as I thought it was gonna be. That was the most violence that happened. There's a strange, sort of like, 19:30 in I've never actually been in a drunken firefight, which I'm quite happy with. It's not like a rite of passage that I feel like I need to do but like, so I can't I don't really feel qualified to make this statement. But it's my observation that like, I feel like in drunken angry bar fights specifically. We've all had them, right. Yeah, I haven't been have you. Have 19:56 you been in a drunken bar fight? You haven't I just 20:00 I started this whole story by saying I haven't. Oh, 20:04 glazing I was I was listening to your story thinking about pi. 20:08 Story go, this is relatable. 20:10 I've never been in Drive. You've been in a drunken firefight. Not in the bar just outside on a route generally around that stuff. 20:17 It's like drunken people around a bar if you've been on a drive, see the scar on my head? I was I do see those head through a window. No way. Yeah. What? Holy shit. Who won that fight? I can't remember. Are you serious? Yeah. I mean, you're lost. That's probably 20:34 how I like to remember it. 20:37 My my. So maybe this? I don't know. I'd like to hear your opinion on this. Because it seems like you have a lot more experience with this stuff than I do. I honestly, like where I'm from people fight a lot. Right? Exactly. didn't fight that much. No, this is this is this is perfect. Actually, I'd like to hear your anecdotal observations, okay. On this thought of when people who are drunk and in a like a raging mood and they want to fight in a bar sort of area inside outside the bar. I have a suspicion that there's like almost an instinctual. Like, they're not thinking they just want to fight. They want to be angry. They want to be violent. But there's something holding them back from like, there's a level they don't cross. Oh, yeah, they don't. They don't like slit somebody's throat with a Smash Ball. Exactly. Or like you don't kick a guy in the nuts. You just it's just like a line. You just don't cross sort of thing. Like it's I'm wondering if you've noticed that like there's like, it's as brutal as it fucking is. There's certain lines almost instinctually you don't cross i Nobody wants to like wreck somebody else's life or their own life from it. But it's not a logical decision as long as right that's honestly the culture where I'm from. I know a large percentage of the population who don't do it anymore, but when they were younger, yeah, they would that was it. They'd like going out getting drunk having a fight and they knew there were other people to like to do that. And they just like a little bit of a rumble a little bit of a fight. But of course I think that's different from the rage alcohol it was it wasn't it was just like it was it was like pivotal people would be fighting and then they might see other people like the next week and go hey, that was a fun fight last week. Wow. That's just it was just like having a great rest of the rumble and they just all beat the shit out of each other and then go home. That's fact I don't know why I don't Well that's a symptom of 22:20 that's fucked. So that brings me to my point of you've got you've got these you know these this two sides we've got Maine and New Brunswick Yeah, you know in a pub drinking together. And I guess there's tension because someone just yelled the wrong thing and it broke up into a bar fight and all it resulted in was a few broken noses and a broken arm not death not you know a war not a war which is like what you know is prideful all around but I mean that's and that's interesting isn't again there's subconscious lines that we can we know we can either cross or not crossed depending on the situation. If war broke out the next day, then suddenly it's okay to murder Do you know what I mean? Whereas like not when you're all civilly drink drinking in a bar but if you want to you want to fight because you still hate each other but like there's a line you don't cross you know, we're not gonna kill you. Well, you have just for a drink, right? Yeah. What are my nachos? 23:13 But isn't that interesting? Yeah, it's on a subconscious level to is how it's framed. Yeah, it's framed within the context of a nice bar environment everyone said Have a good time there's some live music in the corner. Maybe an open mic comedian is bombing How was 23:27 bayonet someone through the chest so sociology is amazing to me like the the the levels of things that are acceptable depending on the circumstances in the environment. Like if you're at the 23:39 if you're in the change room of your gym, and you see a naked man walk past you you're not gonna go you know, it's it's 23:51 it's kind of British. We were swimwear and Roswell. 23:59 Were those little carts they drove into the ocean so you can get in the water without anyone seeing your body? 24:07 If you've ever been in a sauna with a British person, 24:10 everyone else from Europe will go into sort of naked British people will always be wearing something. Are you serious? Yeah. 24:17 British people will not show the bits in a sauna. 24:22 Okay, well, that's other people are like, Hey, here's a sauna. Right? But 24:27 I guess you just destroyed my my theory, which is like, there's certain places where nudity is totally acceptable. And others like if you've watched it depends on your culture, I guess. Yeah. Like a nudist beach. You can't criticize people for not being naked. Right? It's expected but if you're if you're on a bus and they're sitting next to it's, you know, completely naked man, I suddenly hear like when I was when I was a kid, I went to the Glastonbury Festival. My dad at 14, there were people walking around naked and they just had a sign that said naked protest. So suddenly, it's acceptable, because it was Glastonbury. They were like hippies and druids and 25:00 People doing like crazy stuff so brings me back to the the Joker from The Dark Knight who was talking about, you know what's expected if you remember that whole like if one little Mayor dies everybody loses their mind. Do you remember that speech? I do remember that speech? Not all of it something about diesel. No. Cans of diesel blowing up stuff. I mean that's that's in the movie and then he lives and pretends he got his cuts on his face lots of different ways. You'd make a great movie fell into a lawnmower. 25:30 That kind of stuff. 25:33 Do you want to know how I got these scars? I stuffed my face into a blender. spot because it didn't expect such a good impression. Oh really? 25:44 That sarcasm wasn't that bad. Scott's my friend is a really sharp Frisbee. 25:51 I don't know if you're being sarcastic or not. But I'll take the compliment. That was good. I didn't expect you to actually sound like him. When I was in Calgary. Back in 2009. I dressed up as the Joker, I got a jacket and I dyed it purple. Yeah, and I got a green felt vest that was tailored by a friend to fit me. And I had hair that was the same length as Heath Ledger's and it was blondes you'd die early. dyed to green. Nice. And then I got 26:20 some some what does it fake scar tissue and I applied scar makeup along my cheeks and put on the makeup and whatnot and I for about two to three weeks before this for Halloween. I should mention just in case it wasn't clear. I practiced the voice as much as I could you while you took Halloween really serious? I did. Yeah. 26:44 I don't Halloween. I just did Ghostbusters. I just had a Ghostbuster onesie I put it on and then had a black backpack and I just filled it would be and we just walk around with the kids. That's all filled with beer 26:55 to the other. Oh, okay, that was just for you. 26:59 Was Dad I gotta go to sleep at its own. Trust the streams reach back and 27:06 you keep going. 27:08 I just gotta take a little seat in this ditch here for a minute just come find daddy and a half an hour 27:16 goes by. 27:21 So I mentioned that there was death. 27:25 You're gonna love this. Do you know the night of the BB roll? No, no, no, no, of course not was an embarrassment. You know what I realize it. 27:33 So apparently, a bullet was fired into the air by the celebrating soldier. And it ricocheted off a rock and killed a passing farmer. You're kidding as the report of the death. However, 27:48 there is a memorial to a soldier who died and no one can know unsure who they are or how they died. 27:56 So what to so private Hyrum T Smith. These names are crazy, apparently a casualty of the war and died in 28:09 in 1838, and it is supposed to be like famous for being the only casualty apart from the farmer but there was an accident. And there's a memorial in Haynesville Woods along the US Route to a 28:24 and in 1933, a marble marker was put on the site and it was updated and it was now a granite one and it's still there. And no one knows how he died. 28:36 And but there are several theories so there's that there's a memorial for him. But they don't know when no one knows how he died. They don't know who he is. Did you say I don't quite have enough information like he's he's known as the only casualty. But no one really has all the information about it. That's did they find but there are six theories about how he died joining here but they don't know who it is either. They might understand it is that how do they even know if someone died? I don't know. I don't know whether it's just local law. And then they just built a plaque based on like rumor. That's local store. It's very strange that it was passed down through history with no name I know. You know, unless his face was blown off. Maybe like that is a dead man right there. Yeah, exactly. Who is it? We don't know. Can you find his face I was look for his face. Maybe we can figure that out. Didn't pack a spear face 29:26 so these are the theories number one he froze to death because it was very cold. Let's face rose off. However many believe He died in the summer. So number two is face burned off. He was no he was run over by an army supply wagon. 29:39 Number three he was killed by a horse when he went to feed them. Ungrateful horse. Kind of thing a horse would do not trust a horse is shit. 29:49 Okay, fallen through the ice of Lake St. Clair. While he may have died from fallen through the ice. There's never been a Lake St. Clair in Maine. 29:58